Hey, Athletes! Want to learn about carbohydrate rinsing? Interested in how our programming is better than CrossFit? Listen in to the newest episode of the Garage Gym Athlete Podcast!
Episode 01 of The Garage Gym Athlete Podcast is up!
Hey Athletes! This episode kicks off our new format that will be published between our regular seasons of athlete interviews. These episodes will try to cover a new study in the fitness and health realm, talk about recent training, and any other new things that are happening in our world.
This week we talk about carbohydrate rinsing and how it can increase performance. We also state why our programming is not CrossFit and go in depth about what CrossFit programming actually is, all while possibly ruffling some feathers in the process. Lastly we unveil the newest Meet Yourself Saturday workout, Stairway To Heaven!
If you haven’t already, be sure to subscribe to the Garage Gym Athlete podcast either on Stitcher, iTunes, or Google Play by using the link below:
IN THIS 46-MINUTE EPISODE WE DISCUSS:
- Our new podcast format
- What carbohydrate rinsing is
- How endurance athletes use carbohydrate rinsing
- Our programming
- The difference between our programming and CrossFit’s
- Why CrossFit may not be good for you
- Stairway To Heaven, a brand new MYS workout
- And A LOT MORE!!
If you want to go a little bit deeper on this episode, here are some links for you:
Study of the Week
- Carbohydrate mouth rinsing improves resistance training session performance
Garage Gym Athlete Workout of the Week
Be sure to listen to this week’s episode:
Related Resources at End of Three Fitness:
Thanks for listening to the podcast, and if you have any questions be sure to add it to the comments below!
To becoming better!
Hey, my name’s Jerred Moon and I’m part of a group of underground athletes you’ve probably never even heard of before. Most of us don’t even have gym memberships. We don’t have every piece of equipment known to man, nor do we have a ton of time to train and we don’t need it because we’re achieving amazing things without it.
We are Garage Gym Athletes. And these are our stories.
All right, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Garage Gym Athlete podcast. Joe, what’s up man?
Joe Courtney: Hey, what’s up man? I’m excited to get some new formats, new talking points going on.
Jerred Moon: Need to man. So I ever since kind of press pause on the Betterhumanology podcasts and you know, season seven Garage Gym Athlete’s been over, my microphone has been cold and lonely, and I felt just like, I don’t know what to do with my hands type. so what we’re doing guys, we’re going to start [00:01:00] more regular podcasts here at Garage Gym Athlete, in between seasons. We’ll still do seasons, but, you know, we want to be able to communicate with you guys in more frequent basis and making sure that you are.
you know, informed cause, you know, it’s funny, at end of three fitness, one of the big goals I had early on was helping people reach like autonomy and fitness instead of like teaching them the why behind everything. And so you understand how to do a lot of this stuff for yourself. And that’s kind of what I want the Garage Gym Athlete podcast to do is like start teaching a lot of behind the scenes stuff about programming or different methods or studies or whatever.
so people can just be a little more autonomous in their fitness journey. You know, I think that’d be a really cool, and people normally call me out on that, and it’s like, well, don’t you have a service that people pay for? So if they are fully autonomous, they would need to pay for you. And, that’s true.
But I like to look at it as like, Do you change your own oil in your car? No. No, no. Yeah. You pay someone to do it right, because, and you could, you’re fully capable. You could change your own oil, but it’s a lot easier just to get someone else to do it. Who [00:02:00] knows what they’re doing. Mostly not me
Joe Courtney: personally, but
Jerred Moon: people, people could do that.
All right guys, so the new format, I’ll go over it real quick. each week Joe and I are going to sit down and we’re going to cover a study. so some study in the strength conditioning, endurance world, whether it be, you know, fitness-related nutrition-related something, we’ll cover that. Or it could be some sort of method that we’re testing or want to talk about.
and then we’re going to talk about how that can apply to you. So study your method of the week. We’ll also talk about. A topic of the week. this is a little more off the cuff discussion, about any given topic. And then the last part will be the workout of the week, which is typically going to be meet yourself Saturday workouts.
And we’ll talk about those a little bit more. But that’s kind of the format we’re going for right now. And so this week we have study, we’re going to be talking about carbohydrate rinsing, and how you could utilize that. Maybe it’s good or bad or whatever. We’re going to talk about, crossed it and why we don’t do CrossFit.
might, might [00:03:00] ruffle some feathers as I normally do when the words CrossFit or the word crossed, it comes out of my mouth. Someone gets pissed off at me
Joe Courtney: and we’ll kick things off on a, on a good note. All right,
Jerred Moon: so one here, right? and then we will talk about a new meet yourself Saturday workout. that’s brand new here at garage mathlete called stairway to heaven.
so let’s kick it off, man. With the study, the specific study, let me just, reference it. So it’s, if people wanted to look it up, you could just Google, carbohydrate mouth rinsing improves resistance training session performance. and that’s DeSimone. 2018 I don’t know if I said that last name correctly or the person who deals ready, but that is the study that we are reviewing and talking about.
we’re going to kind of reference a lot of other studies in the process inadvertently, because this has been studied a lot, but, Joe, I’ll start with email. What are you, what’s your take just on this in general? So, Do you fully understand what carbohydrate mouth rinsing is and do you understand it enough to explain it to someone else?
[00:04:00] Joe Courtney: Probably not. I understand the concept. I mean, you have a sports drinks that you switching them out for 10 seconds and then I guess some of it gets absorbed, but then you spit the rest out so it doesn’t actually go into your stomach. I had a, I only have a few takes on to what the. Reasoning or a how bind it is, but I don’t know that enough to explain how, how it’s all done.
Jerred Moon: Well, you, you nailed it on the head with like how you do it. So you just like a switch some Gatorade around in your mouth or you can make your own solution. And you spit it out. And there’s been a lot of research on this, specifically in the endurance community. So the book endure by Alex Hutchinson, right?
Yeah. So who we had on the better humanology podcast, I learned a lot about it in his chapter on fuel in his book. And so that’s where I first heard about it in the endurance endurance world. This is like, it’s just like a co, like it’s a proven thing like. I’m swishing the Gatorade around [00:05:00] carbohydrate mouth rinsing is like, it increases endurance performance.
It’s not really, unknown at this point where it’s a little bit unknown is in strength training. people are undecided on whether or not it can actually help you, in your strength and the study that we just mentioned, you know, overall says that it could be possible to, to help someone. Improved strength.
It’s not like overwhelmingly true, but the initial initial findings are that, Hey, yeah, this, this could help you to some degree. what’s your take on that?
Joe Courtney: Oh, I was trying to read the abstract on it and it said that they added a what? 12% more
Jerred Moon: reps? Yeah. Like total volume. The workout. Yeah.
Joe Courtney: Okay. It didn’t, it didn’t, I didn’t see how that actually like, cause they had the set sets and reps, but it didn’t say like how, at least in the abstract, how.
If they were going for a max out and they just did more reps the next time, or what?
Jerred Moon: Yeah. I think that’s actually what they did. they would do a set
Joe Courtney: of 10 rep max and then do it again with the, the rinse and they did more.
Jerred Moon: Yeah. So I think they had like, like a normal. [00:06:00] Like a normal set rep scheme, and then they would do three times max reps at 10 rep max on five compound exercises on five different compound exercises.
So basically testing max reps. and so the group who did the carbohydrate mouth rinsing could. Huh. They pumped out a little bit more repetitions then, the groups that didn’t have carbohydrate rinsing in it.
Joe Courtney: So I wonder if the first thing I thought of was, if you’re renting for 10 seconds, you spit it out, you still have it in your mouth and you’re still going to swallow your saliva.
So what’s the difference in renting or just taking like a shot versus like a mouthful? Rinse.
Jerred Moon: Yeah. And that’s a good question. So. Like, why not just drink it? Is that what you’re saying? Or,
Joe Courtney: or, well, I could drink a tiny bit versus wishing a larger amount.
Jerred Moon: So this is what’s unknown. So the actual, I think some of the scientists are pretending like they understand the mechanism, but I don’t think that they do fully.
And the reason I, I say that is because of Alex Hutchinson’s book and how many different studies he references. They’re saying that, [00:07:00] It goes back to the central governing governor theory that your, your body is going to stop itself from getting hurt, whether that’s in strength training or endurance, by throttling you back mentally like you think that you don’t, you can’t do any more repetitions.
You think you can’t run any faster, and so your, your mind is going to throttle your muscle’s ability to do work. That’s the theory. And they’re saying that w through an unknown mechanism, when a carbohydrate enters the mouth and they looked at their people’s brains on MRI and everything, your brain, your brain lets up and lets you push a little bit harder.
And it’s kind of like tricking your brain into saying, Hey, fuel is on the way. So go ahead and push a little bit harder, but you spit that out so you don’t ever actually consume. the fuel. And so the mechanism is like, is basically like brain trickery is, is what you’re doing. And I mean, the main reason I, the co the question that comes up to me is like, why not just drink Gatorade during your workout?
Which I also in my [00:08:00] own brain would be like, well, I don’t want Gatorade. Like I just don’t want it. Like I don’t need that much sugar during a workout. Like any workout I’m doing, unless it’s over 90 minutes. So that’s the answer to why not just drink it because. More likely than not. You do not need the Gatorade.
Joe Courtney: Yeah. So, actually that was another thing that the next thing I thought about was, it’s almost like the aspartame effect, like the, the fake sweetener effect where your, your mouth thinks you’re getting something sweet and it tells your brain you’re gonna eat something sweet, and then your brain then tells your stomach to prepare for sugar.
But then whatever it did to prepare for it, it’s just not
Jerred Moon: there. Right? Yeah. Well that’s, that’s exactly how it’s working. But what’s interesting about just talking about artificial sweeteners in general, Alex Hutchinson talks about, in his book, they did a bunch of different studies to see if this was true.
If the, if the same would be true, if people would have a. Cause what you’re talking is more like physiological, like digestive and like everything else. and that’s, that’s an improvement. But they’re wondering, okay, well people still get a bump in performance if they have a sweetened [00:09:00] drink that’s sweetened with aspartame or Splenda or whatever, but not actual sugar and all the studies in there.
Like. Placebo controlled, all this other stuff said, no. you know, you can’t, you can’t, you can’t trick your brain into increased performance through a sweetened drink that’s not actual, glucose, not actual sugar. so that, I found that very interesting. because I’ve read the same thing that you’re talking about, like you can, you know, sweet stuff that’s not actual sugar can trick your brain into having a lot of the same bad mechanisms that like, why you shouldn’t have sugar.
But for some reason when you put that overlay that to performance is no longer true.
Joe Courtney: That’s weird. yeah,
Jerred Moon: go ahead. Yeah. Something else.
Joe Courtney: Yeah. So, as far as the drinking versus not drinking, so now that you say the thing about the, brain tricking, so actually I just read the chapter on, sports drinks in.
Good to go. That’s the article that somebody brought up in our community about a month or two ago. And one of the things that they studied is, of course, you know, where they’re high. The endurance athletes should [00:10:00] drink, sports drinks or not. And when they did a study on them, theirs, they had took a guy that would run for like two hours without anything.
And then with sports drinks and whatnot. And what they’ve found was. When most high level racers, when they race at the end of the race, most of them lose like 10% of their body weight because, and there are, they’re technically dehydrated, but it’s because their core temperature raises and their core temperature finds a new like homeostasis.
But when they drink something, that core temperature would lower and their performance would actually get worse.
Jerred Moon: Hmm. Very interesting.
Joe Courtney: So I guess maybe that’s also why. So instead of just, that could be why that they just do the mouth rinse. So if they drank it, they found it, cause a lot of them didn’t like it because they, they didn’t want anything in their stomach swishing around, but they’re still absorbing it, whatever they need through their mouth.
Jerred Moon: Well, that’s, that’s so true. Like they, there’s like, there’s like a. A perfect mix for endurance athletes of like how much you should consume in a race. Like how much can [00:11:00] I, what’s the least amount I can consume and perform at the highest level is kind of what they’re looking for as opposed to just like, yeah, let me shove six bananas in a power gel and like all this other crap in here.
Cause that’s, that’s not the most effective way to fuel during your workout.
Joe Courtney: Yeah. So I wonder if the same would be for like strength exercises and stuff like lifting with the core after core temperature thing. Cause I rarely need to drink stuff. Anything anymore with their during workouts. Like sometimes I’ll take a sip just to take it, but I don’t find like I need
Jerred Moon: to,
Joe Courtney: I go for runs.
I don’t, I don’t take anything with me.
Jerred Moon: Well, and that’s what, you know, that that’s kind of like how I want to put in context of like how like we were talking about this, this study and carbohydrate renting and turns athlete strength training. Like how could this apply to the Garage Gym Athlete. And one thing that I had was, so when you eat, you store a carbohydrates and they’re called glycogen.
That’s how your body stores them glycogen. So you have glycogen stores and that’s what your body uses. So if you eat a really big meal before you go to sleep and then you wake up the next day, the real reason you don’t [00:12:00] need anything to eat when you train in the morning is because. You have plenty of glycogen stores just ready to go.
And unless you’re eating like really low carbohydrate or Quito or something like that. but there was another study, where they, they’re talking about like, who, who this helped most. And it said rinsing and spitting sport drinks produced the biggest benefit in the depleted condition. So depleted glycogen, a smaller benefit and people who are fast it and none at all, and the fed condition.
And so, you know, putting those three, so it helped a lot with people. who just had completely depleted, glycogen stores. So the way you would have completely depleted glycogen stores is you just finished a workout or you have not been eating a lot of carbohydrates. maybe you just woke up, something like that, or you haven’t eaten that much today.
fasted. Obviously it’s facet. And then if you’re already fed, then mouth rinsing doesn’t seem to help that much at all. And the reason I point that out is cause I know a lot of Garage Gym Athletes. Wake up and train first thing in the morning and they asked me, you know, what should they eat? Or I can’t really eat anything.
[00:13:00] Like you don’t need to, yeah. Plenty of glycogen in there. But if you’re looking kind of for a performance boost, without wanting to fill your stomach up with a bunch of crap, try this mouth rinsing technique in the morning. I mean, you could have coffee. the, the studies on, on caffeine are, you know.
Really, really long and all pretty much proved that it’s going to increase your performance. But if you just do a little bit of a carbohydrate renting, like right before you work out and maybe in the middle, it’ll probably give you that little extra boost. Cause I know when I train in the morning, I don’t know if you’re the same Joe, I always notice it a decrease in overall performance.
Like I can get the work done, but I’m just not as like. On fires, I would say be like that afternoon between 11 and two. You know, that’s typically when I’m, I can perform the best. so this is something I’m looking to try, haven’t really tried it that much. especially during those early morning workouts,
Joe Courtney: I still always train fastest no matter what time.
So I don’t, I don’t know how much difference, I, when I’ve eight, sometimes depending on the workout, it’ll like, my stomach will be affected,
Jerred Moon: but, so you definitely need to try this. I mean, you’re training. You’re training [00:14:00] facet but much later in the day, like I don’t do that. I still fast, but I typically have a shake now about an hour before I hit my training.
Joe Courtney: 14 hours in just water and black coffee
Jerred Moon: everyday. You should, you should do it man. You should try the carbohydrate rinsing cause. It doesn’t help facet and then anyone hitting up like a 5:00 AM workout, any Garage Gym Athlete, I think it’d be really beneficial as well.
Joe Courtney: Say it might be the perfect day.
We got 1200 meter repeats and they’re not fun, so
Jerred Moon: I might need an extra boost. Do you have some Gatorade?
Joe Courtney: no. I just have a fit age and kill cliff.
Jerred Moon: Oh man. Wasted money. Just spit. That’s I know, right?
All right, man. Well that pretty much concludes that. I think. The early morning, Garage Gym Athlete or those training facet, definitely something you should try out. It’s kind of the strength side is not fully proven in my opinion yet, but the endurance side, it’s more than proven. So just take that into account when you guys are getting after workouts and trying to use a method like this.
All right. [00:15:00] Are you ready for the next topic? So we’re going to get into this week’s topic, which is why we don’t do CrossFit. Oh man. So I gotta I gotta talk about why this is coming up. I posted on my Instagram account like an idiot. I shouldn’t have done it. You know? it’s good discussion. I’m pulling it up right now.
because anytime I mentioned CrossFit, people get mad. So I wrote an article a long time ago called cross. It’ll make you weaker. And the amount of death threats and hate mail I got for years, for several years after I wrote that article, is very, very controversial. But whatever. So I wrote, I posted in, on my Instagram account.
I’m at EO three fit. and it was, I said, so CrossFit or pool is 600 pounds on the deadlift and runs a 4.5 hour marathon. And I said, in 2013, I pulled 540 pounds on the deadlift and Renna ran a sub four hour marathon with zero days of training, zero days of training for the marathon. I said, he’s got me by 60 pounds on the deadlift.
And I got him by about 45 minutes on the marathon. My only [00:16:00] point, I did this all while not doing CrossFit. And then my caption was, fitness. Fitness is fitness. There is no magic in it. And the, my main point, everyone thought it was like this taking a huge shot of CrossFit. Maybe it was a slight shot across it, but I was more saying, Hey, this guy’s not some amazing athlete because he does CrossFit like you can, you can achieve similar results by just.
Training, like solid training that is not CrossFit because a lot of people out there don’t want to do CrossFit or they don’t want to pursue CrossFit. So that was my only point a, but it opened up a lot. Like you guys can go to my Instagram account and look at all the comments and see what people were saying.
And the overwhelmingly, a lot of people were just arguing that I do CrossFit and I want to call it my own thing. And, I want to talk about that a little bit, but before I do, let me, Joe, you want to live on more backstory backstory. So the, the CrossFitter who pulled 600 and ran four and a half hour marathon, his name’s Austin Valeo, lo. [00:17:00]
I think I pronounced that correctly. And. I had been seeing a lot of that stuff popping up, like on my Facebook newsfeed. And then I started getting emails about it like people, cause people had known that I did something similar and people were asking me about CrossFit and its effectiveness for doing stuff like this.
And. So I finally decided to click on one of those articles. I had already seen it. I had already like seen the titles, but I hadn’t read any of the articles yet, and I knew that he had ran Boston, and the only thing I knew about Boston was Holy shit like that. That’s pretty incredible. This was my, my first thought, because I was like, I know that you have to run, you know, in the, in the.
Like sub 35 age bracket, you have to run like a three hour marathon or faster to qualify for Boston. So when I S when it said he, he lifted 600 pounds and ran the Boston marathon, I was like, dude, Holy shit, that’s really, really freaking impressive. I was like, this guy’s got a sub three hour marathon and a 600 pound deadlift, and then I go to read the article and he’s got a four and a half hour marathon, which is the qualifying time for Boston.
If you’re 75 years old [00:18:00] and a 600 pound deadlift, and I’m not negating that, that’s not impressive. Very impressive still, but it was different than what I thought. and not at the outer outer spectrum of what I thought was. Possible. and so I want to anyway, just to point out that you can get similar results with just solid training.
We ended up having this conversation about CrossFit, whether or not we do CrossFit, and I was gonna explain some of that today. But Joe, first, I wanna get your take on everything
Joe Courtney: on the posts,
Jerred Moon: on the performance on, what’d you think of the overall performance of the dead lift and marathon combo?
Joe Courtney: I mean the, the, so the marathon time is a, I think it’s, it could, could be attributed to some cross it, but there still has to be a lot of, strength, structured strength training to get to 600 pound dead lift.
I think you can’t just like casually do some Metcons or whatever and get there. that marathon time is probably about, for anybody that can, is in shape and is that, does stuff, could probably do
Jerred Moon: stuff. And that’s what I, that’s exactly my thought [00:19:00] is so one year you’re not doing, a Metcon every day and getting a 600 pound deadlift.
It’s just, I mean, the only person who’s like legitimately told me that, that happened. And I believe in, Patrick Barber, you know, legit CrossFit or went across the games multiple times. I had him on the podcast a while back or a long time ago, and he read my cross, they’ll make you weaker article and he’s like, I pulled 500 and I’ve never done a strength program ever.
And I was like. I’ve never heard of such thing. That’s really impressive. but I was like, how long did that take you? And it was like, it was over a decade. And I was like, yeah, well, I mean, I could probably take someone who has a 200 pound deadlift and get them to 500 pounds in like a year or two years, you know, something, you know, like not a decade.
So structured, structured strength is always gonna win. And then, like you said, a CrossFit is really great for general physical preparedness. And so if you’re just prepared physically and like. You can probably do a four and a half to five hour marathon, just don’t die. You know, just like, just keep moving.
You could walk some of it, run here and [00:20:00] there. and you could get that done, at that pace. So I think that’s kind of what he, he accomplished there. Marathon was
Joe Courtney: so, back in 2012 when, when I was deployed, I was there for four months. I pretty much just did my own random CrossFit workouts that’s I was getting into, cause they had a CrossFit tent.
on base, but, I was just looking up random workouts and doing them and doing like 20 to 30 minute Metcon stuff every other day or something like that. And after four months, they had a marathon and half marathon on the base. So I was just like, okay. Yeah. I signed up like the longest I would ever run during that time span was a five K and me, nobody did it.
I signed, I signed up like the week before it was, and I did it in like two Oh five, which isn’t like a awesome time, but. It’s like, okay, I didn’t, I didn’t run, I didn’t prepare. I was out of shape before those four months. It was just, my body was ready and it was, it was fine, but it wasn’t anything to write home about.
Jerred Moon: Right. Yeah, exactly. And, and then this conversation led to, okay, you just do CrossFit, but you church it up and call it garage, [00:21:00] gym, athlete or whatever. And that I do take a little bit of fence to, and I have to talk about, Because this is, I mean, I don’t, we don’t do CrossFit at Garage Gym Athlete. if you, if you think that CrossFit is a Metcon, like by putting together multiple different exercises and doing it for time or something like that, that’s not actually the definition of CrossFit.
The definition of CrossFit is constantly. Varied functional movement performed at high intensity. That is, the definition of CrossFit is not ambiguous. There’s no gray area. There’s not some, Oh, fitness equals CrossFit and CrossFit equals fitness. No, CrossFit is a constantly varied functional movement performed at high intensity.
That is CrossFit. It has a definition, they define it. and the reason that you can’t start going into all these other areas is because the second you start. Programming out strength or you start period izing your programming or you start training to get better at one specific thing. you’re not varied anymore.
Maybe you’re doing function and movement, but maybe you’re only doing high intensity once a week or something like that. You’re not doing CrossFit anymore, just by their own definition [00:22:00] that they said they made their own parameters. If you’re not in those parameters, you’re no longer doing CrossFit. But what a lot of people think or feel, which is not the truth, is that okay, if you’re, if you’re not doing power lifting, if you’re not running, if you’re not cycling, if you’re not an Olympic lifter, if you’re not a bodybuilder, if you know, if you don’t fit, if you’re not an obstacle course racer, if you don’t fit in any of those categories, then what you’re doing is CrossFit.
And that’s not true either. There’s a whole nother area called strength and conditioning. It was around before Greg Glassman was alive. Like this stuff has just been been around. and the example I wanted to give was there’s fitness and then there’s it. So fitness versus CrossFit is like comparing water and coffee.
So water, you know, almost every drink is water. Every drink has water in it, right? Like, your coffee is, is technically like, you could argue to me if you really want it to, that your coffee is just water. It’s a form of water, right? But they’re completely different drinks. They serve different purposes.
they affect your health differently. Everything’s different. so cross it would be coffee, like [00:23:00] it is, it is fitness, but. It’s, it’s hit the beans. It’s now, it’s in a different state. It has its own definition. So you can no longer call coffee water. You can make an argument, but it’s not the same coffee as its own substance has a different chemical makeup and everything like that.
So it’s no longer just water. And that’s kind of how I see the comparison between a fitness and CrossFit. Yeah, there’s a lot of similarities, but the second you start planning things out and, doing, you know, you’re not constantly varied anymore. It’s, And not high intensity, then you’re not doing CrossFit anymore.
You’re just, you’re just not, like, by definition, you’re not doing cross it. By definition. We’re not doing CrossFit, because we’re not constantly varied. We’re repeating a lot of stuff. We’re doing strength programming. We do function a movement. and then we also don’t go high intensity every single day.
So that’s a big, marker, right there is that if you’re not doing high intensity, you’re not doing CrossFit. They threw that in there. They threw that in there. So like everything else is not CrossFit. Now, by their own definition. all right, man. What do you got? Like anything to follow up on anything I said so far, I also,
[00:24:00] Joe Courtney: I made a note about the labels.
People are just obsessed with labels, and if they can’t fit something into a box, they’re gonna push it into any boxes they can.
Jerred Moon: absolutely.
Joe Courtney: So I, and w while you think, well, why? Well, CrossFit does has its set term. Everybody just makes it under another umbrella. It’s like there’s a small circle that’s crossed it, but then everybody else has it all in a much bigger circle.
Jerred Moon: yeah, and you know what’s funny about this is some people were like, well, you, you just want to call your thing something different because like, they think I want to compete with CrossFit from a business perspective. That’s the most ridiculous thing I ever, I’ve ever heard. So from a business perspective, like for anyone thinking about starting like online programming as a business, let me give you a real good tip and quick way to succeed faster than we have.
Say that you do CrossFit, say that you do cross it, that will give you a huge leg up. A CrossFitters love to spend money on online programming. you know, like, it [00:25:00] would be so much easier if we just completely embraced that. And we were like, yes, Garage Gym Athlete is the premier, you know, CrossFit programming for garage gyms around the world.
We’re not. We don’t do CrossFit. We’re not random. We don’t do those things. and so that’s why, that’s why we don’t do CrossFit. Now, another reason why I’ve kind of moved away from just the CrossFit methodology as a whole and a lot of other top coaches and program, or just in the industry. Is because high intensity training done on a daily basis jacks up your cortisol, your cortisol jacks up your hormones, and you know you can go into further jacking up your cortisol and your hormones.
You’re going to increase blood sugar levels. You’re going to gain weight, you’re going to suppress your immune system. You have digestive problems, possible heart disease. All these things come with high intensity or high levels of cortisol, which. Yes, your job can give you high levels of cortisol, your alarm clock in the morning, your high intensity training, your coffee, all these things can do that.
But when you’re doing that on a repeated basis and you’re never recovering, the high intensity model doesn’t work anymore. And it’s been proven through other [00:26:00] studies like, okay, well is there any form of exercise that helps regulate cortisol or down-regulate? and yes, low intensity training does that will actually lower the cortisol levels in your bloodstream.
- They constantly varied, functional movement performed at low intensity, not CrossFit, but helps you lower that cortisol and be more balanced athlete. And I think a lot of people are starting to see that you have to be on both ends of the spectrum to have a well balanced training program that gets you results.
Yeah. Yeah. All right. I could go on and on for that one. Like. Well, I didn’t want to post one thing, or say, read the post. So this, w someone posted, did you see it yesterday in the, in the garage and athlete community group? He, they were like, Hey, where like, where should I go for online programming?
Yeah. Okay. I love that. And this will be a little bit self serving to Garage Gym Athlete, but Hey, it’s our podcast. so they’re, they’re asking, you know, and everyone’s chiming in with like all the typical, like. Places you could follow for online programming and even knew you were like, Hey, look, dude, you, you might want to narrow that [00:27:00] down a bit as you got.
People are suggesting CrossFit people are suggesting strength training, some are strength and conditioning, so on and so forth. So like, what are you interested in? And then one of our athletes, Nathan came in and he said, my wife and I love shred from garage mathlete. We’ve done street parking and RP physique templates.
It’s by far the best he’s talking about GDA. He said it’s far more comprehensive than street parking, which feels as random as most CrossFit cause they had CrossFit. We’re not. That I can not be happy. I can not be a happier customer. We plan to do round of string track later this year and then my trade, try H twoK next year and then I was like, thanks man.
You really explained like what we do. And then he had a follow up and he said, I have so much more to say. He’s like one of the critical components that Garage Gym Athlete gets right that most other online programming fails to grasp is the value of clearly defined goals supported by testing. Each track has an actual training objective, not just get fit.
The programming is tailored toward these specific goals, not in name only. We are focused to test ourselves every three months with benchmark workouts. Workouts to see if we’re actually improving. This is huge for us. The other thing is I love [00:28:00] that the programming will never discard conditioning, like starting strength.
Oh, did I mention endless variety? And the only reason I bring that up is because I feel like he has clearly differentiated why we don’t do CrossFit, or should I say how we don’t do CrossFit is just . Are ridiculous amount of planning and a, you know, programming that we talk about. When I talk about programming, I’m talking about, a year and you know, a month and what we’re doing when across their talks about programming, they’re talking about the different exercises they put together in a workout for the day.
Most of the time. Not like, that’s not what I call programming. That’s like generating a random workout. Well anyway, if anyone disagrees, wants to, you know, fight me on, on the definition of CrossFit or whatever you can. But Greg Glassman defined it himself so you don’t do CrossFit.
Joe Courtney: I actually wanted to kind of almost go backwards to the beginning of, of, of, of the posts, directs toward him.
And I don’t know why I never read it out of any of these articles. I don’t know if it was like, somebody asked him about his success and he was, and he just attributed it to CrossFit. Oh
[00:29:00] Jerred Moon: yeah. And that’s, you know, he was, and those were some of the emails I was getting in. The primary reason I posted that on Instagram was like, people were, he was just stating, you know, in a broad sense, like, this is what a CrossFit athlete can do in the cross cross it protocol can do for you.
But then if you read the articles further, he talks about him and his coach like. Working on like some run training that would help them survive the Boston marathon and like the programming they did to get the 600 pound deadlift. I’m like, dude, say whatever you want. By definition, you’re not doing CrossFit either.
And this is where it gets really great and a lot of people get pissed off. But I just think when you have something that’s so clearly defined, It’s really easy to say what it is and what it isn’t. You, you can’t really argue anymore, you know?
Joe Courtney: So one of the first things I thought of, and this is just my marketing brain, was, you know, you always see those ads on your Instagram, the Instagram models, and the people who have shredded six packs, and they’re like, Hey, can you do some, some of these bandit exercises with our band and say, this is what you use.
And like attributed, and that’s, I think he’s clearly tied into CrossFit and that’s [00:30:00] part of his career. So like, yeah, I’m going to say that’s how I got there.
Jerred Moon: But I mean there are people like rich Froning like, and to be honest, I don’t think, I have no real like big problems with, with CrossFit. Like that’s, that I should just state that.
Like, I think from a company standpoint. They’re like, I’ve taken a level one. So have you. They teach a lot of good information and they’re really about movement and then more about coaching. So this definition probably as is little concern to them. And so it’s a overall, they’ve done a lot of good stuff.
And, you know, going back to what you’re saying with, Austin in a marketing standpoint, like rich Froning, people accused him of like, Hey, you don’t really do CrossFit and you’re doing like structure, structure, strength training. And like. You know, periodizing all this stuff. And he would always come back and be like, no, I do CrossFit, blah, blah.
And I’m like. Yeah. You know what, I would probably say I do CrossFit too. If I’d made millions of dollars and it built my entire life, I would probably be so ingrained and be like, yes, CrossFit. This is CrossFit. Like I am [00:31:00] CrossFit. I understand that, but just by definition, you either are or you are not doing CrossFit.
And I think, CrossFit will always be around as a brand because that’s what’s here now and the people who are getting upset with me on Instagram about this kind of stuff. You are CrossFit like that is crossed across, will always be around, but I think the true methodology at this point of CrossFit is it’s not going to stand the test of time.
That’s just high intensity model every single day. I don’t know, a single coach or programmer who’s got at least 15 to 20 years of experience who was heavily into James Fitzgerald is a, is a great example of this from OPEX. So he’s like, I would call him like the God of fitness. Like he understands a lot more than me.
Like he’s a, he’s a little bit further ahead and who I normally look to and like have conversations with about fitness would be that guy. And a first CrossFit games athlete, to win or the first winner, and he is even moving away from the CrossFit high intensity model. and he’d been hard on CrossFit, like early on, was all about it.
and still helps CrossFit athletes, but he still doesn’t think, like, to [00:32:00] this day, he doesn’t think that it’s the best model for health and the longevity. So that is where we’re at with CrossFit.
Yeah. Yeah, I think that’s, that’s basically it, man. So literally we don’t do CrossFit by definition. And then my last point, I had written down with some people like what you’re doing, Murph, which is a CrossFit workout every Saturday. so that’s CrossFit. Congratulations. You’re doing CrossFit. Here’s my caveat.
You really have to pay attention to the definitions of things. If I’m doing the same workout every Saturday with the intent to be to get better at that workout, even if CrossFit named the workout, I’m no longer doing CrossFit because I’m training for a specific workout and I’m doing it every single week, so I’m not constantly varied anymore.
I’m training for a specific workout. It’s not CrossFit. So you see how there’s a difference in the overall intent on whether or not you’re doing CrossFit, your overall training plan, whether or not you’re doing CrossFit, and then down to the, was this CrossFit today? Okay, baby CrossFit today. But as it CrossFit, I do the same [00:33:00] workout in a week, and the answer would be no.
So that’s it guys. That’s why we don’t do CrossFit for all of our athletes. You’re probably just on board for anyone on the fence who loves CrossFit. Maybe some food for thought for you guys.
Joe Courtney: Also looking at actual competitors range, so like on comp train, and I’ve also done Invictus before. They usually have three or four sections to their daily workouts.
One of them is a skill, one of them is a strength, one of them is accessory, and then another one is actual intense conditioning. So only one of the four pieces is an actual cross the workout that you would see it across the gym to help with that.
Jerred Moon: Yeah, I know. And that’s, see this, this is the direction CrossFit is moving, and then people normally say, yeah, but if you go to a, this is what they always say.
If you go to a good CrossFit gym, they will periodize the strength training and have period eyes, programming. And I’m like. That’s not CrossFit. Like you can say, it might be happening at a CrossFit gym CrossFit box. They might have CrossFit, crossfit.com in the URL, but all all said and done. If you just look [00:34:00] at the definition, it’s not CrossFit anymore.
Once you start going into that level of detail and planning, like you were just saying like some of those, a lot of those things aren’t even technically, crossed it, but they, everyone’s just learning. Cause this, this was like a lot more of a debate. Like if you’re new or you don’t know a lot about CrossFit, like maybe we’re helping you understand.
But at the beginnings of CrossFit, it was almost like an argument. Like, no. All you have to do is this, these high intensity Metcons every day, and it is going to make you the most bad ass human being on the planet. Like that was the actual proposal back in the day when Krause was first coming out and now no one’s doing that anymore.
Now everyone’s like, yeah, well maybe we shouldn’t do high intensity every day. Maybe we should structure the string. Programming like strength and conditioning athletes have been doing for, for decades. And, and maybe we should, you know, periodize the, the, endurance programming like endurance athletes have been doing for decades.
It’s like, well, actually just kind of doing stuff that already existed and not the model that’s been taught or proposed. so [00:35:00] yeah, I’m still, I’m a stickler on definitions, I guess. Yeah.
Joe Courtney: So closing out,
Jerred Moon: cutting out,
Joe Courtney: it’s a good tool. CrossFit is a good tool to mix in, but you know, you need some structure.
Jerred Moon: Yeah, you do,
Joe Courtney: you go 90% heart rate
Jerred Moon: range. Well, that’s my, and you just brought this up, so it’d be my last point then we can move on. Is that, I do think CrossFit will get you really well conditioned that GPP we’re talking about, and we’ll do really good for you on that end, and it can help you lose weight, sweat, all these other things.
but I also think that it’s the long way around. So I talk about Patrick Barbara at the beginning, like. You follow me in my programming, I’ll get you that deadlift in 18 months. If you just want to go random and see a dead lift, like once every other six weeks. If you’re lucky and you want to wait 10 years, you can do that too.
And I’m all about along a PR longterm approach to fitness, but I think you can just get to these really high levels much faster and then just maintain them as opposed to this really slow growing, approach. So. All right, [00:36:00] well let’s talk about the workout of the week. I briefed it to Joe before we got started.
it’s called stairway to heaven, so I’m going to do my best to describe it here on the podcast and we’ll give some tips. So it’s really three parts you’re going to do. Let’s see. Competitor will be 20 reps, established 18 reps and recruit 16 reps of box step-ups every minute on the minute with 40 pound vest until you are no longer to able to fit those amount of reps in one minute.
So does that make sense, Joe? Like you would do like. 20 reps every minute on the minute. And then if for some reason you did 19 the second minute you’re done, you, you kinda, you failed that. Now you either do that to a 20 minute cap. So the way to pass part one would be do it for 24 minutes and congratulations you, you won or succeeded, you didn’t die.
And the first part, and if you did fail or you hit the [00:37:00] 20 minute time cap, you then rest three minutes. You do the exact same thing again, but you dropped 20 pounds out of the vest. So if for some reason you got, you got killed on minute two. of the first with a 40 pound, you’d rest three minutes in and you’d start again.
But then with 20 pounds in the vest, and again, that one’s 20 minute time cap, or until failure, whichever one it is. And then you rest three minutes. And then at the end, if your competitor, you have a 20 minute time cap to finish 400 box step-ups, no vest, established would be 300. Box step ups, no vest and recruit 200 box step ups, no vest.
It’s kind of a very multifaceted, one of our more complex ones. But when you see it all written out, which we will have provided, it makes a lot more sense. What are your thoughts?
Joe Courtney: Ouch. The legs.
Jerred Moon: How would you, strategize this one. so
Joe Courtney: I think the first most important thing to note is that that particular we’re gonna wonder is like how high they’re stepping up.
Unless you’re like six, five, you shouldn’t [00:38:00] use a box over 20 inches.
Jerred Moon: So 2020 inches is, wouldn’t be the recommendation for the body
Joe Courtney: when your leg is on top as you’re, before you’re stepping up your, it should be at, at about 90 degrees, not above or not below 90 degrees. Does that make sense? Not higher.
Jerred Moon: Yeah.
Joe Courtney: so does that, so the shorter people are, just make sure you’re using a low enough box or something like that. yeah. I would probably. As I go through, try and switch up kind of which muscles that I’m using. So like a lot of times with step up, you’re going to be pulling yourself up with your hamstring.
But I noticed a lot of times with a ton of step-ups, my calves get sore because you’re pushing off of the ground. So we’ll watch out for the cabs, as you’re doing this, because you might want to keep pushing yourself off, but they’re going to fatigue a lot faster than the bigger muscles.
Jerred Moon: One thing I noticed when people do a lot of box step-ups in a workout is they favor a leg as well as well.
They’ll do like left leg step up first every time. you know, and if you actually do that, you’re not really working the other leg as [00:39:00] much, you know what I mean? So alternating legs either, either if that’s on a minute basis or a rep basis, make sure that you’re alternating your legs. I’ve actually seen this, I watched the videos of people doing similar workouts and they were just left leg.
Left leg, left leg. I’m like, why are you doing that? so definitely mix that up. and remember that it’s IE moms. So if you, I would go out a little bit faster for the first couple minutes when you start with a 40 pound vest. Cause if you finish those, let’s just say competitor, cause that’s where I’ll do it out.
If I finish those 20 reps in 30 seconds. I get to rest for 30 seconds until the next minute. Right? That’s how email works. so I’m not allowed to even start until the next one. The next minute pops up. And so if you can finish them faster, you’re going to get more rest. Obviously that comes at the cost of having to move faster.
but it’s only 20 minutes. It’s basically a 20 minute NEMA each time. And so that is a, my other tip is. Try and finish them quickly where you can get that rest. Cause if you’re finishing at 58 seconds, it’s pretty much B start again. You’re just rolling right into the next one and you’ll, you’re [00:40:00] going to fail if you’re that close to the wire I, which is fine because then you get to try again with 20 pounds into this.
And if you fail that, that’s fine because then you get. 400 300 or 200 bucks step-ups.
Joe Courtney: They also, as far as the alternating legs, switch legs while you’re on the box at the top. So it’s easier when you step up. Just switch legs real quick and go down. Because when you’re pulling yourself up, you can place your foot there faster than you would be controlling yourself down and then switching
Jerred Moon: and then go to, you’re saying, you’re saying, so if I step up with my left.
Joe Courtney: So, but with your left, as you’re stepping up with your left, switch your weight to your right and then lower your left, like down,
Jerred Moon: select up, left down is what you’re saying. Yeah.
Joe Courtney: I left, I left down. And then you’re tapped in the net. Yeah.
Jerred Moon: And then right up, right down. Is that what you would do
Joe Courtney: left up? Well, I’m trying to think now.
Jerred Moon: I got an I, I could try to think about it as well. I don’t actually know what I would do. I, to be honest, I would probably go, I’d probably do it in like sets of 10 [00:41:00] because what you’re saying right now would like make my brain tired during cause like I wouldn’t know if I was doing it correctly and so I would, I’ll probably go 10 with just stepping up with my left.
Stepping down on my right and then I would switch to 10 stepping up with my right and stepping down with my left instead of alternating every round. Okay.
Joe Courtney: So cause that way you’re keeping your weight onto one side the entire time so that way it’s faster.
Jerred Moon: Yeah. Yeah. Cause you’ll go a lit yoga a little bit faster cause you only have one true transition, if you will.
in between each 10 reps. Right. Like the a transition that, cause I feel like if you, if you switch, it takes just a little bit more time. If you, you know, if you’re. If you do that, every single rep that might not end up costing you anything cause we’re talking about fractions of a second. but I think it’d be a fun, fun workout and the only way to get to heaven.
So you know how we have the harder to kill five miler. That’s kinda how I spurred this one. Or like programmed. It was like the hard to kill five miler. If you don’t keep the pacing, you get killed and you ha you, you can either try again or you’re just dead. And that’s the only way to get to [00:42:00] heaven is to.
You’re the lunges with 40 pounds for all 20 minutes, rest, three minutes, do all the lunches with, 20 pounds for 20 minutes and then do all the lunges under the time cap, which is no joke. Going to be the hardest part of that workout. Even if you hit the first two, cause I just did the math on it. Like that’s, those are going to be kind of hard to hit in the 20 minute timeframe.
So that’s the only way to like truly. Complete the workout and make it to do you have, and it’s like the hard to kill five miler, or I’m conditioned me to the grave, like you’re either going to finish it or you don’t
Joe Courtney: know with the step ups. Now of course you have to have both feet on top of the box hips open, but when you step down only one foot or both feet.
Jerred Moon: Yeah. Both feet down on the ground. Yeah. That’s a good point. Easy way for people to
Joe Courtney: keep some time and you’re still doing the work, but you just,
Jerred Moon: so you’re saying like, so say you stepped up when you left and then you stepped down with your left, leave the right up, and then. Poor question.
Joe Courtney: I think as you put one leg down, the other one just hovered off the [00:43:00] box and then you tapped back down.
Jerred Moon: Yeah, so a good point. I’m going to have to mention that when I did the athlete brief. So yeah, they both feet have to come down to the ground. And the reason I’m doing that is because I’m trying to ever so gently destroy your hip flexors, and if you keep that hip flexor engaged at the top, it’s going to be it just a little bit less range of motion for that hip flexor to do some more movement.
So I want, I want to tax it as much as possible. All right. How’d you like episode? This new episode format?
Joe Courtney: Oh, let’s see how it goes.
Jerred Moon: See what the community says. All right, guys.
Joe Courtney: every week might not be a spicy,
Jerred Moon: ah, yeah. Well, we’ll, we’ll keep it as close as we can. All right guys. That was a, that was it for this first episode.
Let us know how you like the new format you can. if you, one of our athletes let us know in the Facebook group, we’re, you know, she, just a message on Instagram. Joe actually runs the Instagram at Garage Gym Athlete and I am at fit. No, there’s a team of like a thousand people. and then. If you [00:44:00] guys are not one of our athletes, you can go to dot com and start a trial.
We have a lot of different membership options now. get started with us. If you want to not do CrossFit and get a lot better, we are the place to be.
Thanks for listening to the Garage Gym Athlete podcast. Do you want to learn more? Go to garagegymathlete.com. You can learn about our training. Let us send you a copy of our book, The Garage Gym Athlete, or you can even get featured on the Garage Gym Athlete podcast.
Thanks for listening.